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Missed the Turkey Day Marathon? Here’s a Recap90 Replies to “Missed the Turkey Day Marathon? Here’s a Recap”Commenting at Satellite News
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Mike, Bill and Kevin are already on the record saying that if/when Joel revives MST, they don’t want to participate.
I really loved everything about the marathon today, and then I read Bill’s tweets. It is incredibly deflating to consider that much of the money we diehards keep pouring into the incredible Shout! sets goes into the pocket of the guy who may be least worthy of gobbling the profits and is basically the Mike Love of Best Brains. Does anybody have a good relationship with Jim at this point?
In a way you can’t say that the cast hasn’t made money off MST since the show ended, because they’ve all probably made a few bucks on the convention circuit over the years, and the devotion of MISTIES have made projects Rifftrax and CT still popular decades after the cancellation, but residuals would surely help.
Obviously the bad blood and rifts aren’t insurmountable; as just about everybody has been involved with the DVD extras (are those spots paid?) but it’s a damn shame the MST waffle can’t be sliced a bit thicker.
One might interpret the promo as new evidence to the contrary
Anyone else notice how great the renovated Crow was? I don’t think his string has ever been so close to invisible.
Last year was like a greatest hits, and this year was deep cuts. I loved every second of it, and the youtube chat room commentators were, for the most part, hilarious. Can’t wait for next years.
and they must have looped Manos at least 12 times before the marathon started. Averaged about 500-600 people during the Manos loop. For a while after the marathon ended, there was still about 1500 people hanging out in the chat room! 266 people left in there as I type this.
I was very thrilled to see Laserblast today. The Mike/Trace era was not represented last year, so very happy to see it this year.
People change.
#54…
Well, they could have just used it as an opportunity to advertise their products. I believe it was just Kevin from Rifftrax. They will always be associated with MST3K so why not take advantage of that. Business is business. It does suck most of the people who could get residuals don’t. Business is business.
The royalty matter has been mentioned as far back as the Gateway 2000 convention, which was attended by Mike, Kevin, Bill & Mary Jo. When asked about it during a Q&A, they laughed ironically, then the comment was made that, “Compared to the ‘Gilligan’s Island’ people, we got screwed.”
Anyway, I missed most of the marathon. I’ll catch up on the intros later. Am I mistaken or did they run the Ballyhoo-produced segment on Turkey Day from the new set?
A mixed bag for me. Two of my favorite episodes. Sinbad and Spider Invasion. Two good-not great, Pod People and Lost Continent and two weak ones to me, Laserblast and Pumaman. I still cannot understand the popularity of the Pumaman episode.
That being said, I would watch any episode of MST3K since it still is one of my all time favorite shows.
I watched on my PC because not TiVO, not WD Live, not Amazon Fire TV, no device or app I could find and use would display on my TV (they played every other YouTube thing I could find, though). I might have gone to the trouble of plugging my phone in directly but with the company we had I didn’t want to take the time. And my XB1 was in the bedroom (where the cats were shut up — they might have appreciated it, though).
I’m sure it’s because it’s YouTube “live” but YouTube really ought to get that straightened out somehow because it diminishes the value of having a YouTube app on the various devices. I know a lot of folks on the stream reported they were able to get it on their Smart TVs but I am *highly* suspect of this.
In any case, it was fun to see Joel and bots during the bumpers. Personally, that was the best part (since I could just stream any episode I want anyway). I, like others here, would love to see Mike, Bill and Kevin working with Joel and Trace again in *some* manner, but this may be the closest we ever get to it (other than perhaps another convention).
what is the story about the royalties (not know the whole story).
edit
dyslexia strikes again
@61 I didn’t even attempt to watch this on my “smart” tv because it has been my experience that the YouTube app on it is pretty worthless. I am guessing that technology will improve in the future but for now I will stick to my PC. To think that just 20 years ago we were recording the marathons on VHS and closely monitoring to switch out the tapes when they would run out!
I’m glad we understand each other. You won’t be so surprised then when you wake up with a horse’s head in your bed. Yo! :-)
Screwing people over on royalties is as low as a rattlesnake filled with buckshot crawling in a wagon rut.
The creative participants can always be blamed for not thinking ahead and signing away rights prematurely. But greed still sucks. The “winners” could always draw up new contracts and share. Too often, what is “legal” is immoral, and falls somewhere under the blurry stupid axiom of “all is fair in love and war, and business falls under ‘war.’ ”
If it is royalties actually OWED, that’s even worse and demands immediate legal address. I’m unclear which is happening or if both situations are the reality regarding MST3K.
My attorney gleefully invites such transgressions as the latter made by publishers who somehow “forget” to mail royalties specified in contract.
But as Ralph C. said, business is business. It would be naive to believe MST3K was immune to the mechanizations of money, contracts, and legalese, no matter how much we love the show.
If you all feel that strongly about the royalties issue, then don’t purchase another MST3k set.
Thoroughly enjoyed this years marathon. Loved having Crow and Tom fighting over the laser blaster. Wouldn’t be Thanksgiving without a fight! Crow’s remark about how he liked his other voice better was classic. Tom’s “Mighty Voice” return was a big surprise and welcomed too. Joel was terrific and respectful of the competing talent as always.
For those who missed it there is a better quality version of the host segments for the 2014 Turkey Day marathon available on youtube hosted by a user called MST3K Archive. And the whole marathon will be streaming for the whole weekend on the Pluto TV site. Much better quality.
I love each and every one of the special turkey snowflakes this year, Pod People and Lost Continent being among my all time favorite episodes, Pod People being one of my very first MST3k experiences as a kid. And it was just simply fantastic to see Josh and Trace as Servo and Crow again. Joel was of course fabulous again this year with his own gentle brand of sorely missed comedy. It was a wonderful Thanksgiving! I hope you all had one as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-derr2Ve6YQ
http://pluto.tv/#!&channel=MST3K
Somehow I doubt the guys would want us to do that. I think there just comes a point where you want people checking out your work. Although if I were them, I’d try negotiating some kind of deal before agreeing to do any more special features.
Every MST3K fan who wants access to episodes should be obtaining them through legal means. But people who believe that purchasing the episodes puts money in anyone’s pockets beyond Jim and Joel (at least as far as I know) has a right to be informed otherwise so that they will, if they wish, pursue products that do support the other alumni.
It’s not about “us.”
Whether someone is actually owed royalties or whether we as fans just wish all participants were paid forever, non purchase would have no affect on the situation.
While it’s a good thing that J & J receive DVD royalties, I feel like I am happily and mainly supporting Shout Factory’s endeavors more than anything/anyone else.
Oh, and good news on that Ballyhoo scream that occurs during their logo. I have it on somewhat shaky authority that the scream sound clip will be replaced by the hiss and pop of a phonograph needle as it plays over the deadwax portion of Led Zeppelin III where “so mote be it” is etched.
Jim is casting his spell.
As far as royalties go, the last concrete numbers (from 1991, mind you), had Jim and Joel getting 45% each and Kevin and Trace splitting the remaining 10%. If that changed at all with Joel and Trace leaving isn’t really known. But it is confirmed that Jim, Joel and Kevin do receive residuals still. Trace hasn’t ever commented.
Do you guys think that BBI really makes that much profit? It does seem like all it does is sell MST3K merchandise and license the rights to Shout! Factory, so it’s not like they have a lot of overhead, but on the other hand I have to imagine there’s only so much dough to be had from the DVD sales of a cult TV show. Shout! would be getting most of that money, or at least they should, since they are the ones cutting all those checks to sort out the rights issues and BBI would just get a check for doing nothing.
If you take the position that Jim has “wronged” the MST3K alumni by not retroactively cutting them into his share of the company, then it’s no more than Joel has “wronged” them, since they hold an equal share. I think the only truly jerky thing that Jim did was interfere, and effectively sabotage, the Film Crew project with Rhino. I think Mike, Kevin and Bill are well within their rights to be pissed about that, although they triumphed with Rifftrax later on.
There’s also the business of Jim rejecting Joel’s MST3K reunion pitch around 2008, but Jim gave his side of that story in an interview on this very site, and it’s not all that unreasonable. That leaves the much touted feud between he and Joel over the movie that let Joel to leave the show, but there’s only so much we as fans can every really know or understand about that.
I think Jim has become an easy target for 1) being known as the business guy, 2) rarely reaching out to the public for personal reasons, and 3) that really bad web show he tried to fob off as something worthy of the brand name. I forgive him on the basis of sharing that amazing “The Wall” sketch from the KTMA depths, though.
I believe that the amount of profit made by BBI must be chump change compared to mainstream lowest denominator crap entertainment out there that brings in the hundreds of millions.
Sad.
I will never understand Jim sabotaging The Film Crew/Rhino situation, if he did so.
I disagree with the argument that only so many DVDs will be purchased by fans. I have to believe/hope there was more to that than worrying about inner sales competition.
Loved The Film Crew… the premise, the delivery, the style…everything.
Okay, I wasn’t crazy about their cartoon movie theater ticket logo. Probably bad Blockbuster Video memories.
Other than that . . . I was ready to buy matching headphones and show up at conventions and showcase my inner geek.
(I look the most like Kevin, but with Robert Plant hair.)
So who was Servo this time? Frank again?
Yeah, that is definitely Frank as Servo. Really nice to see Tom and Crow again, and I felt Trace and Frank did a good job, but I also kinda don’t think they should do new MST3K without at least Mike, unless they stop doing Rifftrax or something. It would just kind of feel weird, at least for me since I got into the show when it was on Sci-Fi Channel and Rifftrax is pretty good. I like Joel continuing to do these Turkey Day marathons, though.
I am positive it was Josh as Servo, not Frank.
MST3K may not have the biggest profit off residuals, which is possibly a reason why it just hasn’t made sense to shell out residuals to EVERYONE who’s worked on the show.
Manta estimates BBI only brings in ~$280,000 with a staff of 4.
http://www.manta.com/c/mm7d7vl/best-brains-inc?utm_expid=82789632-25.oHnsZFf0S6aL6ZTTV65kcg.0&utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F
That may not be entirely accurate, but its probably not too far off (though the RetroTV deal and a possible public television deal could push that up a little).
And if true, there’s not a very big pie to cut. Especially for people like Bill who only worked the last 3 (short) seasons and 3 season 6 episodes, only 51 episodes of ~198, 25.7% of all content. Which SOUNDS like a lot, but there’s no way Bill would get an even cut with Mike or Kevin or even Mary Jo.
And Jim doesn’t control 100% of BBI anyways, he probably has at least a majority, but it probably isn’t more than a supermajority. I can’t imagine Joel would’ve given up more than 10-15% when he left. He had enough to do Cinematic Titanic.
Could Jim carve out some money for everyone? Probably. Joel probably could, also. But it probably wouldn’t be too much, though I guess any amount would go a long way to mending fences.
Was it me, or were the Trace & Josh voices added last to the video (or prerecorded)? Because the puppet work didn’t seem as good as Trace always was for Crow. Maybe he’s just rusty, but he always put some personality into his portrayal of Crow and it was lacking here.
I believe Jim’s reasoning for wanting The Film Crew canceled was because he wanted Rhino to spend their money on films that were featured on MST3K, not a seperate project entirely.
@78 I was thinking the same thing that the voices were prerecorded and the puppet work was done by someone else. Especially considering there was no eye rolling from Crow and that was one of Trace’s favorite things to do.
Still sounds pretty jerky to me.
To quote cupcake from Riding With Death…
don’t you call him no jerk!
I saw them say that and then shortly after that they seemed to go back on it and say they’d love to be a part of it in some fashion. I was trying to find the interview where they made their initial remarks and the subsequent interview with the change of heart…
How odd that this thread devolved into speculation about how much each of the performers gets paid (or not paid)???!! Not what I expected after viewing this year’s marathon.
I just want to say that I’m glad to see the Turkey Day marathon tradition is alive and well, and hope they continue streaming new marathons for years to come! I loved the “Turkey Day” retrospectives too. Great job Shout!
Re royalty/residual issue
Would it not be up to the talent to negotiate the addition of this compensation in their employment contracts? If so, then there is no issue beyond getting a new agent.
What employment contracts? Nobody in question is employed at BBI.
This issue is hardly unique to Best Brains, the voices on the Simpsons have been begging for years to get in on any cut of the syndication/DVD money and the Simpsons controllers haven’t given it to them. This also played a bigger factor than most people realize when Letterman went to CBS, CBS gave him ownership of his show which NBC refused to do.
The entertainment industry typically has terrible working conditions because everyone thinks it is cool to work in it, meaning that there are way more people who want to do the job than there are job openings. So unless you work at the very highest level, you will be exploited. For MST, it sounds like only people there at the KTMA beginning (Joel and Jim and to a lesser extent Trace and Kevin) share in the big money pool while everyone else was paid a yearly salary for their services. This is not unusual or means that Joel/Jim are bad people, this is very standard in the industry. A lot of actors/actresses you see on the sci-fi convention circuit do that circuit because they don’t get any syndication money from their shows.
@87, thanks for your very informative post.
Does anybody know if there were credits shown during the marathon that say who worked on the new 2014 Hossack mints? I watched at the end but I didn’t see any like there were last year. None of the host segments captured on YouTube have credits at the end either. Did anyone catch them?
That should be Host Segments. Not Hossack mints. Though, Hossack mints are pretty darn refreshing.