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Weekend Discussion Thread: Season 12 Suggestions

By popular demand (see the comments in the “green light” post below), here’s a “What movie would you like them to see in season 12?” thread. Of course, the main focus will be on movies they should riff. But I am expanding it to other suggestions for things that you think will help the show.

For example, in many posts over the last year, I have seen a number of people note that, in season 11, it was sometimes difficult to differentiate between Tom Servo’s voice and Crow’s. I’m going to put this more on Baron than Hampton. I think he needs to deepen his Servo voice a bit. (Tim Ryder, who did the voice of Tom in the live shows last summer, did a great job of making Tom’s voice distinctive.)

So, what movie would you like to see them do? And what tweak would you suggest for the new season?

140 Replies to “Weekend Discussion Thread: Season 12 Suggestions”

  1. Danzilla "Cornjob" McLargeHuge, Student of Kaijuology
    Ignored
    says:

    The Grim Specter of Food:
    Considering that Shout has the rights to all of the Gamera films, I’m honestly surprised we didn’t get Gamera vs. Viras or Gamera vs. Jiger last season. Let’s complete the set!

    Tragically, Shout! lost the right to the Gamera films some years ago. That’s why the MST3K vs Gamera set is so expensive now; it’s out of print and no longer able to be distributed. Mill Creek has the home video rights to Gamera now. If this Kickstarter had come a few years earlier, I imagine Gamera vs Viras, Gamera vs Jiger, and Gamera: Super Monster would have been high on the likelihood list. I’ve heard from a couple of places that Shout! is trying to reaquire the rights, and if they do, I’d expect those three movies to get riffed! I’m, unfortunately, not holding my breath, though. :(

       2 likes

  2. Danzilla "Cornjob" McLargeHuge, Student of Kaijuology
    Ignored
    says:

    Mtwilber:
    Come to think of it, why has Thunderbirds Are Go never been done??? It was made for this sort of treatment.

    This question has come up before, and Joel has said that he doesn’t really think Supermarionation films would work well on the show. He has said the natural stiffness of the puppet’s faces and their lack of complex facial expressions would make it hard to do the kinds of jokes that rely on expressiveness and other body movements. In fact, when the show moved to cable, Best Brains were offered the Supermarionation movies “Invaders from the Deep” and “Revenge of the Mysterons” a second time, and they nearly ended up being redone much like the Sandy Frank Japanese movies ultimately were. Joel, however, declined to re-riff them, citing the above reasons. He’s also a HUGE fan of Gerry and and Sylvia Anderson’s shows and films, as can clearly be seen in the miniature set design in Season 11 and, obviously, in the naming of the Mole People in Season 2. He probably has too much respect for movies like “Thunderbirds Are Go!” to lump them in with the far cheesier and poorly produced movies MST3K is known for.

       4 likes

  3. eegah
    Ignored
    says:

    Here’s my wish list

    Starcrash 2 aka Escape from Galaxy 3
    A Very Brady Christmas
    Disaster on the Coastliner (with Shatner!)
    Wild, Wild Planet
    Mutant Hunt
    Death Ray 2000
    Knock Off (JCVD and the exploding pants!)
    A*P*E
    Captain America 2 (w/ Reb Brown)
    Sssssssss
    Revenge of the Ninja
    Baffled! (with Nimoy!)
    Yor, Hunter from the Future
    Message from Space
    The Concorde: Airport ’79
    Cyclone (w/ Heather Thomas)
    The Swarm
    Death Wish 3

       4 likes

  4. AlbuquerqueTurkey
    Ignored
    says:

    One of these two Japanese films – Frankenstein Conquers the World, or Attack of the Mushroom People. And a bunch of the other ones already suggested!!

       3 likes

  5. Brandon Pierce
    Ignored
    says:

    I really want them to tackle more of the KTMA-era films that weren’t redone in Season 3.

    A re-riff of SST Death Flight and Phase IV is long overdue!

       6 likes

  6. Dan Asnis
    Ignored
    says:

    Dr. Forrester and TVs Frank visit Moon 13

       12 likes

  7. Dan Asnis
    Ignored
    says:

    Devil Dog the Hound of Hell Staring Richard Crena and Kim Richards

       2 likes

  8. pkultgen
    Ignored
    says:

    They need to riff the movie SHE staring with Sandahl Bergman. This is a very cheesy post apocolyptic film that the folks at MST3K or Riff Trax should do. As for the show, I think out of the guest stars, the Mark Hamil sketch worked because it was related to the movie unlike some of the others which if they were going to continue on that, they would need to do that.

       1 likes

  9. goalieboy82
    Ignored
    says:

    some Christian Revelation/end time movies. heck any of those Christian film, not the family ones but the ones they showed to teen groups (for those who went to Church, you know what i am talking about)

       1 likes

  10. Kenotic
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m sitting down after a busy weekend and watching Carnival Magic. This thing is a classic up there with the original run, it’s so wonderfully bizarre and weirdly uncomfortable in places with incoherent logic and plots — and that’s just not me, Gus also thinks so as well.

    All that is to say, the new show holds up, and by the 2nd half of the show people are settling into roles and getting into the rhythm of things. Like others have said, SLOWING DOWN is probably the only major issue I have. Let it breathe a little. Talk slower now and then.

    Beyond that, as they get going it’s been really fun. Jonah has a sense of joy and goofiness that seems to embody bits of Joel and Mike. Kinga/Felicia is a fun mad scientist who doesn’t really get how to be evil (and ALL of her interactions with MaryJo are perfect, I hope they can add her in as much as possible), and Patton seems to love every single second he’s on the show. His commercial break lines are great ways to get Max to chime in on the movie.

    Movies? I don’t know movies and easy it is to get rights, but if keep them weird and/or bad. “The worst we can find,” as the prophets spoke.

       5 likes

  11. Joseph Goodman
    Ignored
    says:

    Mtwilber:
    Come to think of it, why has Thunderbirds Are Go never been done??? It was made for this sort of treatment.

    Aside from the puppet Cliff Richard sequence, which is as unbelievable as it sounds, nothing whatsoever happens in this film. How many riffs can you really squeeze out of endless shots of miniature aircraft getting ready for takeoff?

    My suggestions:

    The Pack (1977) – Joe Don Baker and killer dogs. Seems to me that most of the heavy lifting is already done there…

    Endgame (1983) – Joe D’Amato of Ator infamy delivers a rip-off of Mad Max crossbred with The Running Man.

    Konga (1961) – Michael Gough and not the greatest ape suit ever presented on the screen

       3 likes

  12. goalieboy82
    Ignored
    says:

    goalieboy82:
    some Christian Revelation/end time movies.heck any of those Christian film, not the family ones but the ones they showed to teen groups (for those who went to Church, you know what i am talking about)

    there was one i show when i was going to church youth group and here it is:
    freight elevator to hell (not its real name)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyYWOLgdbcE
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HL84CKUOHj8

       0 likes

  13. H
    Ignored
    says:

    I agree with most of what’s been said, especially bringing shorts back in and being more selective about the roles and number of episodes for guest stars. Some personalized docking footage for ship-based guest stars would be nice too- I always enjoyed it when they went to Rocket Number 9 in the original run.

       0 likes

  14. littleaimishboy
    Ignored
    says:

    Troy Wood:

    #1 – Slow down, and adopt a more conversational tone in the theater. It’s not a race to see who can hit their timecode the fastest.
    #2 – Cherry pick your jokes. If you can’t say something funny, don’t say anything at all.
    #3 – For the love of Torgo, Avoid “State Park” jokes!!!
    #4 – Up the obscure reference factor by about 400%.
    #5 – Knock off the celebrity cameos, unless they’re playing characters from the film.

    Yes yes yes yes yes.

    Oh, and GYMKATA.

       4 likes

  15. Michael Kuzmanovski
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    says:

    My hope is that season 11 only had celebrity cameos because it was an event and people wanted in on it.

       1 likes

  16. ChubbyBlueLine
    Ignored
    says:

    My only problem with Troy Wood’s list: obscure and funny are not mutually dependent. If anything, the obscure jokes are Ward E/Annotated episode fodder. The good riffs are the well written, timed, etc. If you make jokes for the purpose of being obscure, then its a state park joke with a nice rug.

       4 likes

  17. Carl Bruce
    Ignored
    says:

    Alienator (1990). John Phillip Law, Ross Hagen, Jan-Michael Vincent. Need I say more?

       7 likes

  18. Droppo
    Ignored
    says:

    I loved Season 11, but, I do think there are a few things that would make Season 12 demonstrably better:

    1) SLOW DOWN. Again, I say this as a huge fan of Season 11….but, the criticism regarding pace is spot on. The riffs need more space to breathe and they’ll land much, much better. I feel like they did a great job on the tour and I expect them to improve in this area.

    2) Cameos from Mike, Trace, Frank and Joel as “Joel Robinson.” These all felt like glaring omissions…particularly given that Joel appeared as other characters. Everyone wants to see Joel Robinson…it’s never been easier to give the fans what they want on that front. Jonah’s already established. Let’s pass the torch properly. And Mike appearing would truly bring fans of all the eras together. It feels important to do.

    3) Explain how the bots got back to the SOL. I’m totally fine with them being clones/duplicates and the originals still living with Mike.

    4) Shorts!

    5) Add the guitar strum at the end of the (gorgeous) orchestral end theme.

    6) Let Jonah sing the opening theme song. The opening credit sequence is terrific, but, it never felt right having Har Mar Superstar sing it instead of Jonah.

    7) Baron’s Servo really needs more of the sweet/insecure side that Kevin brought. A HUGE part of what makes Servo’s pomposity so lovable is that it’s balanced by his insecurity. Think of his breakdown during the Canada Song. Think of anytime he cries. His need for Joel’s approval. His opening speech during Warrior of the Lost World and how he forgives Crow. Season 11’s Servo totally ignored this critical piece of Tom’s personality. I think that’s way more on the writing than Baron. Baron’s super talented and I’m sure he can nail it. But, I feel like the writers kind of forgot what made Servo great. It felt more Weinstein (“Mighty Servo”) than Murphy which is not the right direction.

       14 likes

  19. Droppo
    Ignored
    says:

    Danzilla “Cornjob” McLargeHuge, Student of Kaijuology:
    Three words:

    MASTER.NINJA. 3.

    Yes, yes, a thousand times yes!!!!!

       4 likes

  20. fatbarkeep
    Ignored
    says:

    By the Time Travelers episode I had no problem differentiating between the voices in the theater, but I agree that Servo should have a somewhat deeper voice. Once Josh gave him the “Tom” persona it just clicked.
    And please make Kinga more evil. She has such a sweet face that eviling her up a bit would be nice.
    Other than that just keep doing what they’re doing. They started out with hyper-fast-paced riffing but I think they slowed it down to a more conversational tone by the end. Season 12 should be much more even-paced in that respect.
    My only real gripe was choosing those self aware movies that poke fun at themselves intentionally. I dislike those movies immensely. Just my two cent opinion, but the Wizard movies were the weakest of last seasons bunch. (and don’t even get me started on that Sharknado drivel) I much more enjoy a heartfelt attempt that fails miserably. Trying counts!
    Just let Joel and the team go. I think this next season will build and improve upon season 11.
    Looking forward to watching!

       2 likes

  21. Megalon
    Ignored
    says:

    I agree, no more celebrity cameos. I’m sure the celebrities brought in a lot of donations to the Kickstarter, so I’m thankful to them for that and for drawing attention to the show. But in general, celebrity cameos are a distraction and against the spirit of the show. They were necessary, maybe, to ensure the Kickstarter’s success, but they are completely unnecessary going forward.

       4 likes

  22. aron craig
    Ignored
    says:

    to copypaste from a Reddit thread on movies for Season 12:

    For my money there’s always been a single movie that just screamed “MST3k” for me. So much so that my MST friends and I started writing a riff for it to produce a fan episode back in college. Alas, senior-level mechanical engineering course plus the two clubs we also ran derailed the project (not helped by most of my Crow parts getting lost when my dad moved without letting me get my still-at-home crap sorted). I present, the most perfect MST3k movie I’ve ever seen: The Devil’s Rain.

    It’s got Ernest Borgnine, Eddie Albert, Ida Lupino, Keenan Wynn, Tom Skerritt, John Travolta, Anton LaVey, and featuring William Shatner! And really bad puppets! You really couldn’t ask for more.

    As for changes, a lot of good stuff has already been mentioned for tweaking but one I haven’t seen yet is the camera-work. Presumably due to the shooting schedule pretty much every shot was the exact same dead-straight, head-on shot.. same angle, same position, same blocking, everything. I hope they mix that up bit more next time out.. bring Jonah in front of the desk, have some shots off to the side, etc.

       4 likes

  23. cityofvoltz
    Ignored
    says:

    1. Shoot all host segments/ moon 13 ON A TRIPOD, the camera shake on the handheld or whatever they are using drove me nuts.

    2. Shorts! I am not one to think fan service is a good thing (episode vii) but shorts is fan service that you can still have a clean soul feeling after doing. They dont cost much to license… If. Sure rifftrax has done alot, but I would gather there is alot of shorts in the sea!

    3. Black and White movies. Joel and crew is smart enough to come up with a way to mask the black bars on the sides. They can make it funny too.

    4 movie list, in no particular order.

    Murder by television , with Bela Lugosi
    Homer price
    Murder by phone
    Condor man
    Argo man

    Any bad Christian movies (yeah… I went to a Christian elementary for one year, the bad movies I had to watch…)

    The uranium conspiracy
    The opium eater
    Cosmos war of the planets
    Either of those bad ewok movies from the 80’s
    Frankenstein meets the space monster
    Galaxina
    Star Odyssey
    The last man on Earth
    War of the robots
    White zombie

       6 likes

  24. Dan Baldwin
    Ignored
    says:

    Okay, I have a major collection of “bad movies” but the two I would suggest if possible:
    They Saved Hitler’s Brain – Makes Plan 9 and Manos look like Citizen Kane
    The Human Vapor – Japanese SciFi with the longest flashback ever, about half the film

       3 likes

  25. Johnny Drama
    Ignored
    says:

    I would like the return of Magic Voice, if only once or twice. I would also be in favor of the return of the Hexfield Viewscreen. While as using Rocket Number 9 for visitors to the SOL is an interesting approach, and definitely a time saving one, I miss the on-set-together interaction the hexfield provided.
    Movies? At least one black and white, and Master Ninja 3, please. (Master Ninja 4-7 for Seasons 13-16!)

       4 likes

  26. ToolmasterJeff
    Ignored
    says:

    I’m in full support of shorts, but I will be a contrarian on B&W films. Color movies, for psychological reasons I honestly don’t understand, seem to be easier to watch. I love 804 – The Deadly Mantis (in my pantis), but many of the B&W films I don’t enjoy quite as much.

    Both B&W and the shorts have the whole 4:3 vs 16:9 issue, but I would imagine that with the shorts mostly in the public domain, they could zoom and crop to fill the wider screen.

    I don’t take issue with editing the films to be in the neighborhood of 80ish minutes, but it can be tough if it edits out plot elements. The Land That Time Forgot was a fun episode, but it was confusing to jump from the Germans back in command to Captain McClure again. It’s the unusual film that cutting more could have been a positive. Completely omitting the Germans briefly retaking the sub would have preserved the primary storyline. In Starcrash, on the other hand, it seemed like too much was cut. However, having not seen the original film, it’s possible the story is just confusing.

    As to movies to do, I think I’ve got one that won’t have any kind of rights issues. It’s called Star Wars… INDUBITABLY!

       0 likes

  27. Troy Wood
    Ignored
    says:

    ToolmasterJeff:
    I’m in full support of shorts, but I will be a contrarian on B&W films. Color movies, for psychological reasons I honestly don’t understand, seem to be easier to watch. I love 804 – The Deadly Mantis (in my pantis), but many of the B&W films I don’t enjoy quite as much.

    I hear where you’re coming from, and I actually support Joel’s decision to go with movies that are all in color and for which good prints exist. Overall, they are easier to watch, and many of the black and white films (in addition to being poorly filmed and badly preserved, so they are physically hard to watch) were also lower budget affairs with limited special effects and sets, so you get lots of scenes of characters just standing around talking at eachother in front of a static drab grey wall. There should certainly be exceptions though, and a lot of classic “bad” movies have been restored/colorized by Legend Films and other distributors in the 20 years since MST3K was last on the air, so just because a movie was originally in black and white, doesn’t necessarily mean it should be out of the running for future seasons.

    Case in point, check out this glorious restored print of Phantom from Space (1953) and tell me it can’t hold it’s own against anything from the 11th season. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fngo-VccDZo

       1 likes

  28. Torque the Dorque
    Ignored
    says:

    I would love to see Timmy return except now he can talk (voiced by Bill). I would also love the occasional original Gypsy voice. Watching MST3K without Gypsy cluttered mind voice is like the Flying Sub without Richard Baseheart.

       1 likes

  29. Benjamin Gibson
    Ignored
    says:

    Frogs. Ray Milland, Sam Elliot, and Joan Van Ark wearing the ugliest yellow jumpsuit ever put on a human. A touch of 70s racial, class, and environmental “awareness”, a butterfly hunter, an embittered lush wife and her bully jock husband…PLUS death by lizard poisoners, Spanish Moss, and a snapping turtle! Frogs is as close to perfect as a movie can be.

    Brotherhood of Satan. You’ve got Strother Martin and LQ Jones just like you never saw them in The Wild Bunch. It’s one part The Crazies, one part Rosemary’s Baby, and perhaps the sweatiest movie ever made. Pretty much the same team went on to make A Boy and his Dog.

    The Manitou. From the best seller by Graham Masterton comes this Tony Curtis, Michael Ansara, and Susan Strasberg!?! vehicle about an evil dead Shaman who is born out of a woman’s shoulder into a very angry little person. With low budget Star Wars era knock-off effects.

    First three I could think of, though I also certainly second She (those Robin Williams Popeye clones are amazing) and The Devil’s Rain.

       1 likes

  30. IR5
    Ignored
    says:

    I agree that Kinga needs to be more evil.

       3 likes

  31. jay
    Ignored
    says:

    IR5:
    I agree that Kinga needs to be more evil.

    And maybe cut back to only five or six cups of coffee in the morning? The thing that made Clayton Forrester so endearing for me was his innate vulnerability. He was always one step away from some socially awkward stumble.

       4 likes

  32. rvoyttbos
    Ignored
    says:

    THE BRAIN 1988

       0 likes

  33. mando3b
    Ignored
    says:

    Have really loved reading all the posts in this WDT; I pray for all of you who know so much about abysmally bad movies. ;) Alas, I have no suggestions of my own on this score, but have my 2 cents worth about more general MSTIE matters:

    1.) My problem with Kinga and Max wasn’t so much that they weren’t evil enough, but that they had so little to do in general: there were no sets/skits ala Clay & Frank, or Pearl/Bobo/Brain Guy. In fact, they mostly just stood side-by-side, facing the camera.
    2.) I, too, have commented before on the similarity of the three voices in the theater–yes, that problem needs to be addressed. Either Hampton or Baron need to do something to make their voice more distinct. But connected with this is the fact that neither of the new ‘bots has much of a personality yet–certainly in comparison to Kevin, Trace & Bill: I can’t distinguish them by voice or by the nature of the riffs.
    3.) In the end, I got used to the band & various minions, but I think they could still be better integrated with the MST3K concept.
    4.) I would love to see something with all three Crows, all three Servos, all three Gypsies and Joel, Mike and Jonah! Now THAT would be fun!
    5.) Yes to shorts & a B/W or two. No to random guest stars, unless they are integrated into the movie or the dynamic on the SOL.

       7 likes

  34. Joseph Goodman
    Ignored
    says:

    What’s all this noise about there being no B&W widescreen films to use? In fact, most of the B&W films shown on MST were shown in theaters in a widescreen format; they’re shown open-matte on MST (check out the visible studio lights in 12 To The Moon… that wouldn’t have been seen in theaters). For the most part, if a Hollywood film began photography after about March 1953, it was meant to be shown matted to widescreen, if it wasn’t a Cinemascope film or some other “hard” widescreen format.

       2 likes

  35. The Original EricJ
    Ignored
    says:

    Joseph Goodman:
    What’s all this noise about there being no B&W widescreen films to use? In fact, most of the B&W films shown on MST were shown in theaters in a widescreen format; they’re shown open-matte on MST (check out the visible studio lights in 12 To The Moon… that wouldn’t have been seen in theaters). For the most part, if a Hollywood film began photography after about March 1953, it was meant to be shown matted to widescreen, if it wasn’t a Cinemascope film or some other “hard” widescreen format.

    And what’s Joel’s noise that the movies “have” to be in widescreen color, or it would confuse the poor fragile minds of All Those Binging Kids who stream HDTV? Movie classics (not too many nowadays, granted) and vintage reruns still air on Netflix, and being in 4:3 B/W hasn’t stopped Netflix from airing Rod Serling or the Dick Van Dyke Show in HD.

    That feels like one of the “Back out of retirement” symptoms of producer Joel trying too hard not to look like a 90’s broadcast-cable dinosaur, and Welcome His New Streaming Overlords with open arms, like the little girl bringing the bouquet of flowers to the fascist dictator.

    To which, for another helpful suggestion, I’d append:

    The Original EricJ:
    #6 – Just because it’s on Netflix, (ahem), JOEL, doesn’t mean we “Binge” everything – Think producer Joel was a little too awed by “the new Netflix streaming era”, and tried too hard to make the show one “Binge-worthy” linked element.For Stranger Things, maybe, but for MST3K, we still watch one movie at a time, we don’t need “plots” and “cliffhangers”, and we don’t need serialized references to unite the entire season into one Season-Long Serial Arc.And if he’s doing it because he is a Binge Fan, good lord, the national problem’s bigger than we thought.

    with:
    #9 – Don’t OVERWORK yourselves, guys – Not sure if it was Netflix’s rule that they require entire seasons before airing (unlike Hulu stringing us out on weekly premieres of their series), Joel catching Binge-Disease in his spare time, or just trying to deliver on his Kickstarter investors, but grinding out one entire season in one go looked like a lot of work, and the strain showed near the end.
    One of the complaints about S7 was that the riffing felt too rushed, desperate and cranky, with the A-staff of writers too distracted with the Movie, and a general free-floating sense of anger and frustration from having to deal with Universal suits. And if there’s general consensus about which were the misfires of S11, the last two episodes, Christmas/Wasn’t and At the Earth’s Core–which should have been perfect episode fodder–instead latched onto one or two would-be “running gags” (the Widdle Baby and the “PT Mitchell” yum-yum gags), beat them into the Earth’s Core, and raced hell-bent for the end credits and the end of the season, wedding-cliffhanger included. And filled in the cracks with more Muppets jokes when in doubt.
    In the CC and SciFi broadcast days, they’d have an entire season to work on an entire season, which gave them more chance to concentrate on the individual episodes, read their fan-discussion reviews, and get more of an idea for what callbacks had caught on with the audience, and which jokes (like the S9 world-trolling) weren’t working or they should probably back off of. Here, if they’d gone in with a wrong idea, we were now stuck with it, and there was nothing anyone could do about it until we got another season…Maybe.

    Even if Netflix requires entire bulk-binging seasons because Reed Hastings thinks it’s neato, Netflix isn’t above hyping big premiere dates–How about delivering S12 in two halves, 6-7 episodes at a time, with a few months’ breather in between? If you’re a binging fan saying that’s “Too long to wait for new episodes”, you ARE part of the problem.

       3 likes

  36. Matthew Scott Redwine
    Ignored
    says:

    Gamera vs Viras
    Gamera vs Jiger
    Gamera Super Monster

    Anyone disagree????

       1 likes

  37. Gromilini
    Ignored
    says:

    Troy Wood:
    And here’s my top 5 suggestions for the cast and crew:

    #1 – Slow down, and adopt a more conversational tone in the theater…

    #2 – Cherry pick your jokes. If you can’t say something funny, don’t say anything at all. Overall, where season 11 fell down the most was in the quality control of the riffing…

    #3 – For the love of Torgo, Avoid “State Park” jokes!!! The in-house term for calling something exactly what it is (ex: “this looks like a State Park” when the scene is, in fact, filmed in a state park, or “that guy looks like Henry Kissinger”, when yep, the guy does indeed look like Kissinger)…

    #4 – Up the obscure reference factor by about 400%…

    #5 – Knock off the celebrity cameos, unless they’re playing characters from the film…

    #1 – I didn’t really have a problem with the speed of the riffs, but very much agree that they lacked that spontaneous, comfortable feel present in the original. I read a rumor at some point that Jonah, Baron, and Hampton recorded their riffs separately–can anyone confirm/deny this? If so, that would be my most heartfelt suggestion: guys, please be in the same room.

    #2 – As much as I wanted to love Season 11, the plain fact of the matter was (for me), it needed to be funnier. I smiled a lot, but the number of times I laughed out loud, I could count on one hand. I would love them to up their writing game.

    #3 – Yes. It never got as bad as Dr. F’s and Frank’s riffing attempt at Fu Manchu, but on occasion, I was uncomfortably reminded of it. Again, YMMV.

    #4 – Remember “We don’t worry about who is going to ‘get’ it; the right people will get it.”?

    #5 – I don’t have an issue with guest appearances per se. But yeah, they have to pass the funny test.

    Great movie suggestions from everyone. Not much to add, except to jump on the “more B&W movies” and “include shorts” bandwagons. Think about it, won’t you?

       4 likes

  38. brown131
    Ignored
    says:

    * I seem to recall Joel saying something to the effect that one of the reasons that B&W films weren’t used was because many of them won’t fit into the now-a-days required HD format.

    * A change that I’d like to see is to have Joel step back a little and have Jonah step in a little more as producer of the show. As much as I love Joel, I’d like to see Jonah (and others in the new cast for that matter) drive the show’s direction a little more. I guess then I’d feel like this is a really a reboot and a new group is taking it forward. Maybe this will just happen naturally as the new folks get experience with the show.

       2 likes

  39. Mibbitmaker
    Ignored
    says:

    On the subject of Kinga being more evil… I’d really like to see Felicia do more scenery-chewing (admittedly a hard thing to do well and not just be annoying) like Trace and Mary Jo were so great at as head Mads. A fish-eye lens effect (like both previous “Forresters” did) here, a maniacal cackle there. As to vulnerability, I did see little signs of that in Kinga already. Adding to that could be done.

    The fact that KTMA/Comedy Channel Clayton and Comedy Central Pearl started out less “out there” would make Kinga’s start in season 11 fit in with precedent, too.

       5 likes

  40. goalieboy82
    Ignored
    says:

    goalieboy82:
    a whole episode of just shorts.

    they should do this (Public Domain Shorts) so they could use the money on something big (maybe something big name film).

       1 likes

  41. Droppo
    Ignored
    says:

    I thought Kinga was perfect and fully realized from Episode 1. Loved Felicia’s performance.

       7 likes

  42. Cornjob
    Ignored
    says:

    I second Frogs (made a good Rifftrack) and The Manitou. I didn’t think anyone else had seen The Manitou. The movie was definitely not better than the book.

       1 likes

  43. MSTieScott
    Ignored
    says:

    I’ve gone on record as being underwhelmed by season 11. But I want the show to get better and keep getting more seasons. If I was able to get the staff’s collective ear, if I was only allowed to make one suggestion, I know exactly what I would say:

    Bring back the writers’ room while writing riffs for the movie.

    Yes, I know it’s inconvenient. Yes, I know it’s more expensive. Yes, I know it’s less efficient. But it makes the end product so much better. It’s why Cinematic Titanic, RiffTrax, and season 11 all feel lacking compared to the original series.

    When you put a bunch of funny people in a room together and let them bounce ideas off of one another, you get different jokes than when you send all of your writers away to sit alone with a copy of a movie and a computer, writing with the mindset of “What joke can I write to fill this gap?”

    In the writers’ room of the Comedy Central/Sci-Fi Channel days, people would go off on tangents. But they’d also build off of what the others said. The jokes would be funnier. Running gags would come about naturally rather than feel forced. And the writing would take on the air of a group of funny people forced to suffer through this bad movie together. And when the show is about a group of funny characters forced to suffer through a bad movie together, that’s an important vibe for the writing to have.

    It goes without saying that Jonah, Hampton, and Baron need to be present during this writing process. Then, when they perform in the theater together, they’ll remember how the jokes were originally delivered. That will be reflected in their performances, which will alleviate the show’s current problem that it sounds like three guys reading jokes rather than watching and riffing a movie.

    If, after I gave that note, the show’s staff hadn’t kicked me out yet, then my next note would be:

    Give Baron Vaughn acting lessons.

    I feel bad giving this note. I get that the thing that made the original series charming was that it was a bunch of average people (albeit people who frequently had stand-up experience) putting together a semi-professional TV show. That imperfection is part of the show’s appeal.

    But last season, it felt like every single thing Tom Servo said was in one of two tones:

    1) Sarcastic
    2) Singing

    I know that every actor puts his own spin on the bots’ personalities, but “self-satisfied, ironic detachment” is not a good look on Servo. I need to get the impression that the character has some genuine emotions.

    The best example comes from Starcrash (about 34 minutes into the episode). When the giant shapely feminine robot is destroyed, Servo’s line is, “No, my metallic angel! My beloved! Not her! Take me!” And Baron completely throws the line away, delivering it like he would any other “put a line in the movie character’s mouth” riff (the fact that he races through it so as not to step on the movie’s dialogue doesn’t help matters).

    The joke was supposed to be that Servo and Crow were attracted to the sexy robot character. And that Tom was genuinely distraught that she was killed. But the joke only works if the actor plays it straight. If Tom doesn’t act like he actually cares, then it isn’t funny.

    So many of Servo’s lines were delivered in the exact same manner. There’s no character to this character.

    After that, I’m sure the staff would be escorting me off the premises. As I left, I would shout some other minor notes:

    Don’t use the bubble wipe to edit between different takes of the same scene. It’s distracting and it calls attention to a flaw. Spend the time to get one good take.

    Cut back on the antics in the theater. Pretty much every time someone pulls out a prop, the resulting joke isn’t funny. The conceit is supposed to be that these characters are watching the movie for the first time. But if, for example, someone produces a bullhorn, it means they knew the joke was coming. (Exceptions can be made when necessary for standards purposes – I thought the joke with the drones was funny.)

    Leave Gypsy out of the theater. I’m all for giving her more to do, but her two appearances per movie were more confusing than anything. Why is she dropping off or picking up that box? (Why would you do that for the entire season and never explain it?) Plus, each appearance was another “Look out, a joke is coming!” moment in a show that’s supposed to look like it’s spontaneous.

    I’m not saying these things because I want to be nitpicky or a whiner. I’m saying them because I felt that season 11 didn’t live up to the seasons before it, and these are ways to make the show better.

       17 likes

  44. Droppo
    Ignored
    says:

    MSTieScott:
    I’ve gone on record as being underwhelmed by season 11. But I want the show to get better and keep getting more seasons. If I was able to get the staff’s collective ear, if I was only allowed to make one suggestion, I know exactly what I would say:

    Bring back the writers’ room while writing riffs for the movie.

    Yes, I know it’s inconvenient. Yes, I know it’s more expensive. Yes, I know it’s less efficient. But it makes the end product so much better. It’s why Cinematic Titanic, RiffTrax, and season 11 all feel lacking compared to the original series.

    When you put a bunch of funny people in a room together and let them bounce ideas off of one another, you get different jokes than when you send all of your writers away to sit alone with a copy of a movie and a computer, writing with the mindset of “What joke can I write to fill this gap?”

    In the writers’ room of the Comedy Central/Sci-Fi Channel days, people would go off on tangents. But they’d also build off of what the others said. The jokes would be funnier. Running gags would come about naturally rather than feel forced. And the writing would take on the air of a group of funny people forced to suffer through this bad movie together. And when the show is about a group of funny characters forced to suffer through a bad movie together, that’s an important vibe for the writing to have.

    It goes without saying that Jonah, Hampton, and Baron need to be present during this writing process. Then, when they perform in the theater together, they’ll remember how the jokes were originally delivered. That will be reflected in their performances, which will alleviate the show’s current problem that it sounds like three guys reading jokes rather than watching and riffing a movie.

    If, after I gave that note, the show’s staff hadn’t kicked me out yet, then my next note would be:

    Give Baron Vaughn acting lessons.

    I feel bad giving this note. I get that the thing that made the original series charming was that it was a bunch of average people (albeit people who frequently had stand-up experience) putting together a semi-professional TV show. That imperfection is part of the show’s appeal.

    But last season, it felt like every single thing Tom Servo said was in one of two tones:

    1) Sarcastic
    2) Singing

    I know that every actor puts his own spin on the bots’ personalities, but “self-satisfied, ironic detachment” is not a good look on Servo. I need to get the impression that the character has some genuine emotions.

    The best example comes from Starcrash (about 34 minutes into the episode). When the giant shapely feminine robot is destroyed, Servo’s line is, “No, my metallic angel! My beloved! Not her! Take me!” And Baron completely throws the line away, delivering it like he would any other “put a line in the movie character’s mouth” riff (the fact that he races through it so as not to step on the movie’s dialogue doesn’t help matters).

    The joke was supposed to be that Servo and Crow were attracted to the sexy robot character. And that Tom was genuinely distraught that she was killed. But the joke only works if the actor plays it straight. If Tom doesn’t act like he actually cares, then it isn’t funny.

    So many of Servo’s lines were delivered in the exact same manner. There’s no character to this character.

    After that, I’m sure the staff would be escorting me off the premises. As I left, I would shout some other minor notes:

    Don’t use the bubble wipe to edit between different takes of the same scene. It’s distracting and it calls attention to a flaw. Spend the time to get one good take.

    Cut back on the antics in the theater. Pretty much every time someone pulls out a prop, the resulting joke isn’t funny. The conceit is supposed to be that these characters are watching the movie for the first time. But if, for example, someone produces a bullhorn, it means they knew the joke was coming. (Exceptions can be made when necessary for standards purposes – I thought the joke with the drones was funny.)

    Leave Gypsy out of the theater. I’m all for giving her more to do, but her two appearances per movie were more confusing than anything. Why is she dropping off or picking up that box? (Why would you do that for the entire season and never explain it?) Plus, each appearance was another “Look out, a joke is coming!” moment in a show that’s supposed to look like it’s spontaneous.

    I’m not saying these things because I want to be nitpicky or a whiner. I’m saying them because I felt that season 11 didn’t live up to the seasons before it, and these are ways to make the show better.

    I don’t think it’s as much a Baron thing as a writing thing. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I think the writers forgot how hilariously insecure and emotional Servo is and simplified his personality to “pompous.” Or as you aptly put it, “self-satisfied, ironic detachment.” Agreed that is NOT the Servo we know and love. Seems like an easy fix.

       6 likes

  45. Endoplasmic Reticulum
    Ignored
    says:

    mando3b:

    1.) My problem with Kinga and Max wasn’t so much that they weren’t evil enough, but that they had so little to do in general: there were no sets/skits ala Clay & Frank, or Pearl/Bobo/Brain Guy. In fact, they mostly just stood side-by-side, facing the camera.

    I think you’ve hit on something here. Clay and Frank always seemed like they were up to something else. When we see them they’re taking a slice out of their otherwise busy, evil-filled day to send a little unpleasantness to the SOL. Kinga and Max are presented more like they’re celebrity MCs for a PBS pledge drive. So far Kinga comes off more like a brat than an accomplished villainess. Maybe a better laboratory can help her develop more depth.

    Pearl’s chat with Mike in “Time Travelers” is a great example of depth. She’s oh-so-pleasant, while still making it clear that she still intends to crush his soul. Now THAT’s a villainess with personality. Kinga will have a hard time developing into much if all she’s allowed to do is stand in front of a wall.

       11 likes

  46. majorjoe23
    Ignored
    says:

    Cornjob:
    I second Frogs (made a good Rifftrack) and The Manitou. I didn’t think anyone else had seen The Manitou. The movie was definitely not better than the book.

    Did Rifftrax do Frogs?

       0 likes

  47. Lawgiver
    Ignored
    says:

    Agree with most of the suggestions for the show itself, but I do have one new thing to add:

    Bring back Gypsy’s old voice, it’s one of the funniest things about the character. I get that they’re going for PC in casting a woman, but have her do the falsetto voice. If I (who have no talent) can imitate the original Gypsy (Jim and Patrick), then an actress should be able to.

       1 likes

  48. The Original EricJ
    Ignored
    says:

    majorjoe23: Did Rifftrax do Frogs?

    Not according to their website…Warty the Toad, maybe, but nothing with Ray Milland. Whew.

    MSTieScott:
    Leave Gypsy out of the theater. I’m all for giving her more to do, but her two appearances per movie were more confusing than anything. Why is she dropping off or picking up that box? (Why would you do that for the entire season and never explain it?) Plus, each appearance was another “Look out, a joke is coming!” moment in a show that’s supposed to look like it’s spontaneous.

    Lawgiver:
    Bring back Gypsy’s old voice, it’s one of the funniest things about the character. I get that they’re going for PC in casting a woman, but have her do the falsetto voice. If I (who have no talent) can imitate the original Gypsy (Jim and Patrick), then an actress should be able to.

    Oh, good lord, I’d actually forgotten about that:
    Yes–Whatever they thought they were doing with Smart Magic-Voice Gypsy, and yes, trying to make her more “PC” with more female writers on the staff, and give her more of the riffing she didn’t get in Hercules&Captive Women…please STOP. She’s not doing anything, period, and her riffs are about as funny as a morning TV-news host’s.
    As for the box,I was literally guessing that the box was Joel’s old “Recorded riff, ready for processing” idea left over from the early Cinematic Titanic videos, and I repeat, guessing.

    I-i-…i-it’s j-just….seriously, what DID they think they were doing?

       1 likes

  49. Cornjob
    Ignored
    says:

    Hor-riff-ic productions did Frogs. I like most of their riffs.

       1 likes

  50. sdogmoore
    Ignored
    says:

    I know they only want to do wide-screen color films for obvious reasons, but that does eliminate anything prior to mid-1950s – which is a shame as I love seeing the old b&w poverty row and independent mess-terpieces. We wouldn’t have Manos under the current criteria.
    And I love the shorts as well, but they are similarly handicapped by often being Academy Ratio and/or B&W.
    I wish they could creatively present such films to suit their format – maybe seat the ‘bots on the edges similar to Cinematic Titanic? meh…
    There has got to be a way…

       0 likes

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