Joel Hodgson, Creator of Mystery Science Theater 3000, Announces Kickstarter to #BringBackMST3K For a New Generation
For more than 25 years, the award-winning comedy television series Mystery Science Theater 3000 has been known as one of the best cult TV shows in history. The story of a human host and his robot sidekicks, trapped aboard a satellite and forced to watch cheesy movies by his captor, MST3K has maintained its reputation thanks largely to its fervently devoted fan base, known as MSTies. This morning, Joel Hodgson, creator and former host of the beloved show, announced that he is turning to the fans to bring back Mystery Science Theater 3000 for a new generation.
“I don’t think there’s ever been a show more dependent on its fans than Mystery Science Theater 3000,” Hodgson says. “Twenty-five years ago, we asked our fans to ‘Keep Circulating The Tapes’ and sharing MST3K with their friends and family to help the show find its audience. Now, I’m hoping the fans will join me again to “Keep Circulating the URL” of our Kickstarter, so that we can bring MST3K back to life for a new generation.”
Through Kickstarter, Hodgson hopes to raise at least $2 million – enough to make three brand new, feature length episodes – with an ultimate goal of raising the $5.5. million needed to make a full season of twelve episodes. While Hodgson will be involved in writing and all facets of production of the new series, the new episodes will feature a new host, new Mads and of course, new cheesy movies to riff.
To contribute to the campaign and for updates, visit www.bringbackmst3k.com, and follow MST3K on Facebook (facebook.com/MST3K), Twitter (@MST3K) and Instagram (@MST3K).
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The Reboot Moves Forward. Step One: Crowdfunding.Here’s the press release:
332 Replies to “The Reboot Moves Forward. Step One: Crowdfunding.”Commenting at Satellite News
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That’s exactly why I prefer the later years to the earlier years. I HATE bad movies and I like to watch the MST3K crew tear them a new sprocket hole. I enjoy the gentler riffing of the early years, but not nearly as much as the vitriolic riffing of the later years.
But the skill is in saying “You suck!” in a humorous fashion, and I think they do that brilliantly in the latter era MST episodes, and slightly less brillianly with RiffTrax – although I still find RT very funny and a few RT efforts rise to MST levels, particularly the shorts.
Hmmm, quote function not working right now? Anyways…
Brandon Pierce:
“I think a lot of it boils down to wanting to just move on, and not dwell on the past.”
Then why were they involved with CT to begin with which rode on the appeal of MST3K and why do Trace and Frank promote their current two man show as “The Mads Are Back”? Even the online ad banners for Rifftrax use the tag of “Mystery Science Theater meets ____” So, needless to say, this “Oh, people just want to move on from their old Mystery Science Theater identities” line seems disingenuous. And many iconic shows will retain former alumni to help with writing and cameos to keep the legacy and quality intact which is why Joel has said he wants help from the old cast and they’re all welcome to join him but so far the resounding response has been, “Sorry, but no.” Again, no surprise there is no involvement from the RT crew but Trace and Josh saying no right off the bat is surprising. My theory is they’re either not ready to commit since as of now, it’s a Kickstarter after all, and maybe Shout wasn’t so forthcoming on making them an offer yet. I’m sure it all boils down to wanting to get paid for their contribution to MST3K going forward as Bill has said himself on Twitter. I’m still optimistic for the reboot but having even Joel’s closest allies so far saying NOPE right off the bat isn’t the kind of PR the KS and Shout need right now. Shout buying the rights from Jim Mallon should have ushered in a sense of, “YES! FINALLY! Now MST3K will be revived and former alumni will also get to contribute and finally profit.” So much for that. The KS is off to a good start and yes, we should be used to the concept by now of a new host and new voices but buzz for the reboot would be even better with at least one of two of the former Brains on board to at least help with writing.
Stacia:
“There have been what I will politely call some terse responses to being asked if they’re involved with the reboot.
Yes, that response from Trace was very blunt. Come on Shout, make these good people an offer!
I don’t think saying I’m disappointed in what some people have said counts as a ‘personal attack.’ I never called anyone ‘stupid.’ Not sure where in the world that came from. A bad fan? Didn’t say that either. Nor ‘backwards.’ I stand by my comment that some responses have struck me as cynical and ungrateful, though. If your feelings were hurt, however, I apologize.
I HATE TOM SERVO’s NEW VOICE!
Look I’m supporting the show – but I really do think everyone is entitled to their opinion, and certainly if someone would rather not give their money to support something like this – that’s their choice. In fact, if that’s the way most fans feel – that the show shouldn’t come back in ANY iteration – then I suppose it shouldn’t…
…I am hoping those fans are in the minority. Personally – this type of thing makes me excited. Without fan support, Star Trek would’ve died in the ’80s (hell in the ’60s), Doctor Who wouldn’t have this whole load of new episodes, we wouldn’t be getting The Force Awakens. No Brady Bunch or Beverly Hillbillies movies would’ve have ever graced the silver screen. The pop culture sandbox would be a poorer place without them. (And yes I am joking about the last two.)
That said…none of those properties asked for money from the fans up front. (Oh wait, Star Wars just got 20 million fans to buy their movies tickets two months in advance…so maybe sometimes…) Fans have the complete right to say “no I don’t think so”. While I don’t agree with it, it seems an acceptable response to me.
However, where I DO agree with you is in feeling disappointment that there isn’t universal enthusiasm at the CHANCE…not the certainty…but the CHANCE of quality new MST3K product. Even if someone says “I don’t want to support this”, I would hope they would still WANT it to exist. Well…cynical times and all.
I can’t get that quote out of my head today.
Oh- and they are $18,000 from the 1/2way mark.
A Kickstarter asks for but doesn’t actually get the money up front. If the project isn’t funded, would-be funders aren’t charged. That’s the beauty of it, vs. say getting a loan from a bank. So it’s not really a handout, more of a subsidy. (That being said, yeah, the monetary value [speaking generally, across all the Kickstarters I’ve looked at] of the rewards is generally less than that of the pledge.)
Anyway, I think it’s a great idea to gauge length, breadth, and depth of support for this new iteration. I’d like to see more former castmembers as part of it– ideally, I think revivals need a balance of old and new– but as has been said, it was kind of Joel’s baby, so it’s neat to let him get another crack at it. I’m really looking forward to what movies they’ll riff– I like that they’re trying to go for obscure. As much as I’ve noted movies I’ve seen that deserve to be riffed, it’s always a treat to see something I’ve never even heard of before. (Personally, I hope they do “From Hell It Came,” which I still haven’t been able to track down, and I only know of it from a Sci-Fi era chat with I want to say Kevin Murphy who said it has a guy who dresses up as a tree.)
Oh – they hit $1 million. By my watch 10th fastest all-time to $1 million on Kickstarter.
Agree completely. Not even in the writing room, but just some nods about cameos, even one time cameos, or god forbid, a tweet or two like–“hey check out what Joel is doing! Cool, huh. I wonder if [my character] will make an apperance *wink*”
Because of CT, and because of the new MST3K Monday on RiffTrax I really thought they were all going to be on board at least in the since of verbally backing it and talk of some cameos.
For me, I think the series ended on a fine note and I have more than enough MST eps to tide me off ‘til doomsday. But that being said, I’d certainly like to see this thing go ahead for one simple reason. I’d like to see Joel happy. I’ve read all the stories about how Joel said it was a personal tragedy having to leave the show. And how he decided to pursue Cinematic Titantic when he wasn’t able to restart the show with Jim Mallon’s permission. It’s obvious this is a dream come true for him. So I’d be interested to hear how it all turns out, regardless if a new MST turns into an out of the park home run or a modest ground out to short. If anything, it might give Joel enough clout to pursue other projects, if he has anything else up his sleeve.
I’m pleased to see the show possibly return In my mind, I was kinda hoping to this would have a “Star Trek: The Next Generation” vibe as compared to the original. Similar in spirit, but different enough to feel fresh. I love Tom and Crow, but would have liked to have seen new bots. The Mads? Maybe an omnipresent and diabolical computer instead, a la HAL. Same formula, but with a twist.
But hey, new MST3K won’t be unwelcome, and with Joel at the helm, I think he’ll keep it as pure in spirit as he can. I agree that the online route would work best. I think it behooves MST3K to stay somewhat “indie.” The cable TV landscape isn’t what it was in the early 90s, and if Rifftrax can make a go if it online, so can MST.
As for the $5.5 million, 90% of that will be used to bribe Susan Hart ;-)
This sums up at least part of how I feel very well. Joel has given all of us something that we prize and consider very special, and while it’s perfectly understandable that one might feel some trepidation or uncertainty, we should at least be nominally supportive of this chance he has to get ‘his baby’ back in front of audiences. ‘I’d like to see Joel happy.’ I like that. :-)
Two things – Rifftrax writing has Mike, Kevin, Bill, Conor, and Sean as regular writers. They have several contributing writers, many of which are on Twitter (@undeadmolly, @mcs212, @longwall26, and more). They split each movie up in to 15, 20 minute chunks and a writer will write all the jokes for that chunk. Then they rehearse and the main 5 guys have final say over the final script. I have culled this description together from AMAs, twitter posts, and Rifftrax forum posts.
Second – I don’t think anyone specifically said “I will absolutely not at any point be involved in the MST3k reboot, no matter what happens.” I think there is a chance, however slim, that any of them will be involved as cameos, etc. This is just my 2 cents.
Hmmm, looks like Trace deleted his rather blunt tweets from yesterday about not being involved with the reboot.
I never actually found any tweets from Trace, looking as early as yesterday afternoon, only people mentioning them on forums. I thought maybe they were DMs or something.
The tweets are still on the Rifftrax Forum under MST3K reboot
Eh, people are allowed to feel how they feel; some can be optimistic, some can be pessimistic, and they can contribute as much or as little to the Kickstarter as they want. (I want to throw some money in but things are tight right now, so I may wait a couple of weeks and see how finances are looking.)
Realistically, if (or, as it’s looking now that we’re past the $1M mark, when) the new series happens, it’s going to get some things right from the start and going to take some time to settle into others. The first few Sci-Fi episodes definitely have a feeling that they’re settling into the new premise, the new cast and characters, and the weird network-mandated story arc. The KTMA era, of course, was about as rough as it gets.
Whatever we get is likely to be a work-in-progress, at least for the first few episodes. I suspect most backers are okay with that.
So, who else thinks they’ll hit the $2 million goal today?
For everyone thinking about contributing, let us all ask ourselves this: How many times have we watched an episode of MST3K that we taped for free? If everyone contributed just one dollar for each time you watched a show, how much would that be? Don’t we ALL already owe Joel a king’s ransom for all the free entertainment we’ve gotten over the years from the funniest show in tv history?
answer: hell yes, we do!
I’m hearing what everybody’s saying about wanting new blood and new ideas, and to that end, I think I’ll donate to Incognito Cinema Warriors instead.
I’m not sure about this. For me it’s always been either Joel or Mike, so it might be hard to adjust to a whole new crew. But, like someone mentioned earlier, I don’t have to watch, so why spoil it for those that do want to? But I’ll feel compelled to watch! But I’m also not a big believer in the whole “I’m going to give you my hard earned money so you can make a project you want without having to pay for it yourself so I can then pay you to buy the product I gave you money to make” model of doing things. But, seeing as how they are already over a MILLION dollars!!!!, I’m clearly in the minority on this. So to those of you who are willing to pay to make it happen, thanks!
It’s doubtful. Most campaigns see the majority of their money come in on the first day and the last day. Things are going to taper off a bit after the initial excitement.
Or, maybe they don’t. Everything doesn’t have to devolve into an endless game of internet telephone (“Did you hear what so-and-so said? Here’s what they said about you!”) instantly.
I have seen extremely mixed results with Kickstarter in other creative fields and obviously it came after Cinematic Titanic was all but over already. But, for a well-known brand that’s considered a good move these days, even with a major company backing them. Weird but what do i know.
As for a lot of mixed enthusiasms in the comments above, i can only say that brand name official MST3K with a new cast must be something people wanted, as what people say they want–the original cast touring in all-but-MST-name–got such mixed results.
The phrase that sticks in our mind about the spirit of “survival” Joel-era riffing is “Rock-climbing”.
These were movies nobody could get through, and we sympathized with the characters for having to keep making jokes for twenty solid minutes of rock-climbing–Even the characters pretending to crack from the strain were a funny comment on the movie.
The snark of the Mike era was that “(pshh!) Okay, let’s get through this piece o’crap, and get back to our cool spaceship stuff”, where the movie was an annoying non-entity, and their frustration was how bored they were with having to watch it (“C’mon, movie, start doing something!”) They laughed at their own jokes, and we were supposed to laugh at them hiply laughing at their own jokes. It don’t work like that in comedy–Namely because of the comic rule that Nobody Likes A B***y. (I’m not allowed to use the B-word in reference to Mike, you know.) On the rare, rare occasions when M&tB did crack, and attempt to flee Hobgoblins, it was funnier, because now he had a joke that WE were allowed to share in too, how generous.
As I’ve said many times, I know the experience of being trapped in “outer space” (or at least a college town with one main street at 2am after the buses and subways shut down) having to watch cheesy sci-fi movies with an audience because there’s nowhere else to go.
For those who never had that public experience, try this at home: Around 2 am (we’ll assume you live alone, or everyone else is asleep), sit yourself in your favorite comfy chair, with pajamas, microwave popcorn and Snuggle-blanket, turn on Warner Instant Archive, and put on an old or obscure sci-fi movie in the dark and isolation. A classic like Forbidden Planet or Rollerball will be cooler, but now try putting on “Galaxina”. Or “The Omega Man”. Or George Segal in “The Terminal Man”. And do not at any time attempt to distract yourself by changing the channel, using your cellphone, or leaving the room to take any more snack or bathroom breaks than absolutely necessary. You will quickly discover that the instinct to riff is not about Hate or Hipness, it’s about…well, you’ll discover what it’s about. Now multiply this feeling times three or four hundred, as the entire audience with the same feeling starts forming a united Hive-Mind of Coolness for their mutual survival. (It’s similar to the funky audience-energy at the CT or RT Live riffings, even without the guys on stage.)
Early MST3K tapped into this feeling back when we were all watching the same movie on Friday night, and only imagining us all being in the same audience.
Although even funnier is demonstrating by comic example how the movie sucks–As opposed to Bill Corbett’s generic time-filling “1001 Riffs For All Occasions” when things got slow. (“Y’know, guys, after all these years, I finally figured out what sucks? This movie.” “Well, this movie put me in a good mood…for hanging myself!” Ba-dum ching.)
Guilt is even more apparent and less disputable when the accused is allowed to convict itself, in which case the comic is only doing a public service for justice.
Yes, while Joel owns The Show now, he’s still in “retirement” mode after CT, where he doesn’t take the dichotomy of the two schools of riffing that seriously, shrugs off “Well, it’s the other guy’s show now, he’ll do it like he does it,”, and throws You Should Really Just Relax(tm) up as a smokescreen if anyone pushes the argument further.
Which does, yes, put it in the territory of thinking we’d watch web Flash animation of The Adventures of Crow & Servo, rather than appreciating the specific riffing talents of the comics. (Or, since post-Beatles breakup metaphors abound, the idea the Beatles once had to create an actual Sgt. Pepper group out of other musicians, write songs for them, and send them out on tour instead. Not quite the same thing.)
As it is, all we have left of Wilder’s movie is “Brain Donors” instead, with John Turturro, Mel Smith and Bob “Jiffy Jeff” Nelson, and while it’s not A Night at the Opera, I’ll admit I liked it.
Although, to be fair, out of our entire new-generation rage-management Some Movies Have It Coming(tm) culture I will give credit to Honest Trailers, despite its attempt to tilt at popular windmills, for keeping its humor specifically on target, and rooted from the shared experiences of other burned fans rather than the comic’s own elitist tantrums. (As opposed to other Internet comics who shall remain nameless, who attempt to wring laughs from “Marvel and Transformers are popular because pathetic nerds like it!”) When I went out of Disney’s “Tomorrowland” last summer, I will confess my first reaction in the theater lobby was “Where, where is the Honest Trailer for this one? Hand me a cellphone, I need to find one immediately!”
Nostalgia Critic wanders dangerously into Cool YouTube Guy personal-bile territory, but has enough timing and obscure references to be funny. Again, note that you’re allowed to be as angry as you like in comedy if you also happen to be SMART. And Smart involves knowing things that lesser people might not, or at least have embarrassingly forgotten for years until you remind them.
As noted, there’s a difference between the show and the by-products.
My worry, however, is that “Fridays” and “Life Stinks”-era Mel Brooks are proof that no one in Los Angeles knows how to be funny. NY, definitely, Minneapolis, possibly, but LA has some kind of anti-Funny dampening force-field that surrounds the confines of the city. :( )
While Joel says that he won’t be on-air, the demand for the original cast may be too hard to resist. Back in 1986, The Monkees reformed as a group and went out on tour. The reason that tour happened was because the company that owned the rights was producing a TV series “The New Monkees” starring a bunch of young no names. They thought it would be great publicity for the New show to have the old guys tour for a couple of months and have MTV run a marathon of old episodes. The New Monkees wound up being cancelled in a few weeks and the remaining old Monkees are still touring. I just doubt that when the 11th hour approaches, that MST3K fans will want to see Joel McHale, Adam Levine or Tosh in that jumpsuit.
I don’t like being a pessimist when it comes to one of if not my all-time favorite TV shows, but I see an issue with the math in all of this. For $5.5 million you get 12 episodes, for $2 million you get three. It’s set up so that it gets more efficient the more money they have to produce episodes. Are people going to be disappointed if they’ve put in, say, $200 expecting 12 new episodes and they’ve only raised enough for 3? $5.5 million seems to me to be a tall order for any crowdfunding campaign. They’ve gotten over $1 million already in about 24 hours, but more than 80% of that was in the first 12. I’d love for them to reach the ultimate stretch goal, but right now I can’t say I see it as being likely. MST3K has always been a niche product. We may be finding out soon just how niche it is.
In addition, the idea of making these specifically to shop it around seems like it’ll be full of heartache. I don’t think a TV network is likely to pick it up. ICWXP tried that with no success, and it just seems to me like times have changed too much. Now an online distributor I could see maybe picking it up, but even there they’d have to sell it pretty hard. I’m just not sure about that.
I want Joel to try putting together a new MST3K, I really do. If I’m saying anything, it’s that I wish the business model for this was more like the one that made Rifftrax successful. Then I could see it very realistically being another 200 episodes and even lasting 30 years.
I am very excited about seeing new MST3K. I will say it will probably not be as good as the original but hopefully it’ll be as fun and smart as the original series.
I do want to bring up one thing that I think is a bit off putting and that is saying that there were two sets of characters and cast on the original MST3K run. That’s not really true at all. The cast changed out piecemeal throughout the series and there was never at any point in the series where the wasn’t some sort of continuity from one episodes to episode. The biggest character change in the series was from Joel to Mike and even then we had the same Mad’s from the previous 3 and half seasons and the same Crow from the first of the series and same Tom for 3 and a half seasons.
Even with what some people (EricJ) say SciFi had a pretty good continuity from season 7 to season 8 and despite not understanding or watching SciFi episodes they did keep a reason for Mike and the Bots to be forced to watch bad movies. Although Season 8 had the most amount of character change it still had Pearl from season 7 and Mike and Tom from half way through season 5.
My point is there were never any wholesale lineup change during the series. I think that is one of the reasons that it was able to stay successful. That is one of the biggest things that bother me for the new season is that there won’t be any old blood in it. I understand having the new host and mads not be played by the original cast but certainly the robots could have. I also don’t agree that they should have done different robots or try to screw with the theme of the show. One of the reasons that MST3K was so great throughout the show is that it never took it seriously and though there were always minor changes you could watch an episode from KTMA and and episode from season 10 and still see the same show.
With that said I’m still donating $250 to the show and hope we get all 12 episodes and some great riffs and great sketches and songs.
Trace’s tweets are still there. You have to view replies to see them.
So it looks like Joel has become the Stan Lee of MST3K. While it’s smart for Shout to contract with Joel to run the creative, they are still making the business decisions and that’s a lot of pressure for Joel, it’s an entirely different situation than before. Hopefully he can be happy doing that – it looks good so far.
I’m excited to see what a new cast can do with the concept. But I’d like to see a real demo reel, the Kickstarter video isn’t all that impressive.
I wonder if Shout will now be more or less likely to pay more for the movie rights for those hard-to-obtain episodes? And does this make KTMA episodes more or less likely?
bad wolf:
“Or, maybe they don’t. Everything doesn’t have to devolve into an endless game of internet telephone (“Did you hear what so-and-so said? Here’s what they said about you!”) instantly.”
Or maybe they do and maybe all I was saying obviously is that it would help a bit from things going in circles because the entire point of citing something willfully typed by an actual, certified person from the show is obviously the exact opposite of the “telephone” game and unsubstantiated fan chatter, since it’s ya know, a quote coming from the person themselves.
Kenneth:
“Trace’s tweets are still there. You have to view replies to see them.”
Got it, thanks. Bummer. :/
@Captain Cab–fair enough but the quotes always get interpreted by the reporter. See also the poster above reading his ire at Jim Mallon into a random joke Joel told. And don’t even get me started on EricJ!
Sure, i have a few things i’d like/hope for, but this is what it is and we’ll have to wait a bit longer to see where everything lands, i guess.
Can I just say that I love Crow’s new voice! Whoever’s performing it absolutely nailed it. It sounds like Crow!
Servo sounds…different. But, think about how long it took Bill and Kevin to get comfortable with their new roles. I think that’s why I’m so impressed by the new Crow. It sounds like he’s already figured it out!
Count me among the MSTies that is super excited for this. A new MST3K with Joel at the helm while I still get to enjoy Mike, Kevin and Bill via Rifftrax? I’m a very grateful MSTie.
@bad wolf
I’m not trying to propagate a “bad blood” narrative here, like I said, just reporting what the people themselves have typed. I am disappointed there is no involvement from other cast members so far but like I have said before and as you are saying, we just need to ride it out for now, because who knows? Again, new cast, awesome. But it’d still be nice if Shout or which ever streaming service in the future (hopefully) picks it up makes an offer Trace and others find worth their time. There’s no question the reboot is going to benefit greatly from Joel’s direct inout and guidance, so the same should go for any other veteran of the show.
Anyways, on a positive note, very happy to see it’s already crossed the two million mark. I’m still holding off a bit on donating. This is a competitive month for my wallet and I’d like to see and hear some more details before I dive in.
@180
You mean it sounds like he nailed Trace’s Crow. Certainly not Bill’s Crow. And if they are getting new voice actors why are they trying to be like the previous guys?
And now if I may get greedy and Comic Book Guy-esque….here are my humble suggestions/fervent hopes:
1. Have Joel Robinson, the character, appear. Everyone loves Joel and it would make the transition much easier to accept. If, as Joel said on AMA, this is not a reboot but a new season….Joel Robinson should make an appearance. Joel playing another character in a cameo just wouldn’t make sense.
2. Keep the heart. I’m actually very optimistic about this given that Joel is at the helm. Snark without warmth is just not MST3K. I loved the idea that Joel/Mike and the bots were a family. I believe that emotional connection is a huge part of why MST3K has endured. Joel/Mike and the bots felt like they were a part of our families.
3. I don’t know what’s going on with the rest of the alumni right now…but, straighten it out. They are beloved and should be involved even if it’s cameos. With one exception, I loathe the Pearl character with the fire of a thousand suns…so, I’m desperately hoping that character (not Mary Jo, just Pearl) is excluded. But, Trace and Frank should be no-brainers. If the Rifftrax guys want to keep RT separate, I get it…but, they should absolutely be invited to participate. It’s a simple way to generate enormous good will and interest from long-time fans. Who wouldn’t nerd out to see Mike Nelson, TV’s Frank or Dr. Forrester again?
4. Please let my long-time dream of a Master Ninja III riff come to fruition! It was tantalizingly close in Season 6 and then they replaced it with a boring Mexican wrestling movie! I would pay double for this.
Maybe so the transition will seem smoother?
Remember when Kevin and Bill took over Servo and Crow, at first they tried to sound a little like their predecessors Josh and trace, respectively (with varying degrees of success).
Possibly of interest or maybe not, but Shout Factory got a copy of the KTMA version of Time of the Apes pulled from youtube.
They’re not new robots/characters. It’s still Crow and Servo. I feel like some continuity is really important. It should evoke the Crow’s and Servo’s we’ve known. Also, is there one MSTie that DISLIKES the idea of Trace’s Crow being a good blueprint? I love what Bill did and am a huge fan of his work on Rifftrax, but, even he would say that Trace’s Crow is beloved. I mean, Trace created the role and played him for 7 seasons and a movie.
Now, if you’re saying: then why not simply bring back Trace? Totally valid. But, if it’s a new cast and the same robots, I’d be really disoriented if they didn’t look to Trace’s performance for inspiration. Same for Kevin/Servo. I mean, I know Josh originated the role…but, Kevin WAS Tom Servo. Season 1 wasn’t even shown again until recently and those shows pale in comparison to Seasons 2-10.
@Droppo
“4. Please let my long-time dream of a Master Ninja III riff come to fruition! It was tantalizingly close in Season 6 and then they replaced it with a boring Mexican wrestling movie! I would pay double for this.”
YES PLEASE
Had no idea there was more Master Ninja footage. Curse those Van Pattens and their far reaching tendrils which no doubt kept it hidden so long.
Yes, there is! In fact, it was originally included in the MST3K newsletter (Satellite News, the printed edition!) as the final episode of Season 6. It was later replaced by Samson vs. The Vampire Women. The 1-2 punch of that switcheroo and that it was my beloved TV’s Frank’s last episode resulted in Deep Hurting for me.
That’s what happens when Hollywood keeps screwing up beloved “franchises”. (I hate that word but don’t know else to call it.) Everyone was thrilled that the creator of Star Wars was going to do more SW movies, and look how that turned out.
And I dare say, most MSTies have a deeper fondness for MST3K than even the most ardent SW fan. When something means that much to you, you really don’t want to see it screwed up. Still, Joel is no George Lucas, so I think there’s reason to be hopeful.
True, but it’s bound to fuel unsubstantiated fan chatter. If Trace posts the single word “Nope,” or the phrase “Not completely accurate,” that’s open to a whole lot of interpretation. Saying “Sorry, that won’t be happening” when asked about a Dr. F cameo is a bit more concrete, but still leaves a lot of questions.
I think there are two reasons for the relative vagueness. One is that it’s Twitter, and Twitter is terrible for complex and nuanced conversations, by its nature.
Another is that these guys are professionals, and if they don’t plan on being on the new show, they don’t owe us an explanation. There are a lot of reasons why one of the old cast might not be interested in returning, everything from pay disputes to wanting to move on to just plain being too busy with other things. As fans, we’re interested in knowing what’s really going on with the cast, but we’re not entitled to know. It’s up to them whether they want to share or not, and it looks like they don’t.
Basically, it’s in people’s nature to read too much into simple answers.
If someone says “Trace said he won’t be involved in the new show,” that’s a true statement. But as soon as someone says “Trace won’t be involved in the new show because…,” then we’re into speculation territory.
I’m looking forward to the new show. I’d love to see some of the old cast show back up. Joel’s made it sound like he’s open to it but it sure doesn’t sound like it’s in the cards right now. That’s disappointing to me as a fan, but nobody is obligated to come back to MST3K if they don’t feel like it. And we’ve still got Rifftrax, and Trace and Frank’s live shows, and all the other stuff the former cast members are up to.
Frank always wanted to do a Mexican wrestling movie and they finally let him on his send off. So if you loved Frank, you’d want him to be happy, right?
I love TV’s Frank with all my heart. But, I also ADORE Max Keller & Peter McCallister.
Who cares if it fuels speculation? We’re free to speculate and of course a response from an actual cast member in the midst of the reboot’s announcement is going to generate a passionate discussion of some kind, it’s not like we’re going on hearsay. An MST3K reboot kickstarter was just launched yesterday, welcome to Speculation Land, population, us. And where did I say or insinuate they “owe us an explanation”? Nowhere. The point still stands that the fact Trace, one of Joel’s closest allies himself took the time to say “Sorry. That’s not happening” is the exact opposite of unsubstantiated gossip and “fan chatter.” Trace has said he’s not involved in a very affirmative manner so the question is, why is that? It’s a very legitimate point of discussion. If there are people out there who want to go over the top as to why that may be, that’s their problem.
Droppo:
“Yes, there is! In fact, it was originally included in the MST3K newsletter (Satellite News, the printed edition!) as the final episode of Season 6. It was later replaced by Samson vs. The Vampire Women. The 1-2 punch of that switcheroo and that it was my beloved TV’s Frank’s last episode resulted in Deep Hurting for me.”
Yeah, but Sampson vs the Vampire Women was a great episode and Frank’s personal choice for his exit, gotta cut it some slack in that regard.
Which, coincidentally, is the same place I ever claimed that you did.
I’m not talking about you in particular. I’m talking about fanboy culture in general. Lots of folks feel like they’re entitled to know what’s going on behind the scenes of things they like. They’re not. It’s nice when creators share details, but it’s not an obligation.
Is it, though?
If he wanted to share his thoughts, he would have. He hasn’t. Any speculation to his motivations amounts to putting words in his mouth. I don’t think that’s legitimate at all; I think it’s downright disrespectful.
Well, when people spread misinformation, and it starts to dominate the conversation, that becomes everyone’s problem, no? I mean, we’ve seen plenty of threads degenerate into conspiracy theories about Jim Mallon. Before it was Jim, there was a period where a lot of people thought there was bad blood between Joel and Mike, and kept pushing that narrative. I think we’re heading for another round of that stuff, and maybe it’s inevitable, but that doesn’t mean I have to like it.
I love all the fandom police that showed up to tell people what they are and aren’t allowed to think about this.
@Thad #194
OK, no offense but I find your stance boring. It comes off as anti-discussion, overly reverent and pandering. It shouldn’t have to be explained ad nauseam that there’s nothing wrong or inherently disrespectful about speculating about the former cast members’ current stances on the reboot which they’re clearly stating of their own free will as long as it’s done in moderation. I’m done.
I look at the other MST3k alumni’s answers more pragmatically. They are all in the publics eye. They are paid performers. They have no moral obligation to tell their fans anything but bad PR can haunt them. A flat out no right off the bat is bound to generate a ton of questions that they might not want to answer. Some vague statement of congratulations and saying I haven’t had a chance to talk to Joel about it but I’m real busy right now would put off the questions. Then keep putting it off for a while. If for some reason, they really don’t want to be in the new show, they can say no later when there isn’t as much interest and it wouldn’t draw so much negative attention.
We can make up for lost time: More Al Adamson and Larry Buchanan films, please. :-)
(I am not asking for Jerry Warren [The Wild World of Batwoman] films because the ‘bots would probably go insane, but they need to at least do Frankenstein Island.)
It looks like an update has been posted on the Kickstarter page. Only backers of the project can see this. Can anyone who has donated confirm what the latest update is?
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/mst3k/bringbackmst3k/updates