My only gripe is that the piece does use the same “they’re in competition” meme that most of the press and blog observers have been trotting out. I guess it makes a more interesting article to create a dramatic element like that, but I really disagree with that analysis. This is not a zero-sum game. There are plenty of bad movies and the market is plenty big enough to accomodate all these projects. “The more…the merrier,” as Mike says in the piece.
UPDATE: The full, unedited version of the article, along with the transcript of the author’s telephone conversation with Mike, are posted in the RiffTrax Roundtable forum.
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Sampo, the writer is obviously nostalgiac for the old “Joel vs. Mike” flame wars.
There can be only one!
What do they each feel about each others projects?
Mike tipped the iceburg & there are loads of other people involved. It’s very funny to see three different parties doing MST3K-like projects at the same time.
Did I say funny? I mean painful in my gym shorts areas.
With the dearth of bad movies available for riffing, I expect Mike and Joel will each plot elaborate assassinations against the other for domination of the limited stink pile of bad movies heretofore unriffed.
Or so the tone of the article would have you belief.
Two riffing companies vying for control of twenty-five billon square hectares of putrid movies, and growing, isn’t liable to devolve into Lord of the Flies, or Lord of the Dance, God willing.
Randy
Funny, I never saw it as a competition, but it has raised a question for me since Joel H. announced “Cinematic Titanic”. If pretty much all of the original creators, cast and crew of MST3K are now free and working together in small groups, why are they not considering working all together again and reviving MST3K? It’s what their fans want and they know that and they are already producing new material that’s similar anyway. Instead of two or three different versions of MST3K-lite, how about more actual MST3K?
Come on Joel, Mike, Kevin, Trace, Paul, Mary Jo, Bill, etc., instead of working together separately in small groups, how about joining all together again for more “Join Us” and “Movie Sign”! Long live MST3K!
In re: working together again, I kind of get the idea from reading between the lines that almost every MST alumni had a bad experience separating from the show. They might prefer to work in a new project that they’ve co-created that could bring them continuing income over and above their initial performance and payment.
But who knows? If Pink Floyd could get back together for even one show, anything’s possible.
Bob:
I don’t think you’ve really thought this through. Mike Nelson has worked long and hard to create Rifftrax and it is a successful, going concern. Are you suggesting he should just drop it and join some untested new project?
Joel Hodgson has created a great name for himself in the public mind. He has a vision he wants to pursue, and has recruited some other MST3k alumni, having convinced them that his vision is worth a shot. Are you suggesting he should abandon it?
Who would be in charge of this grand unified MST3K group? Businesses are not social clubs. You have to have leaders and followers. Why should Mike, Joel or Jim, each of whom are recognized leaders with proven track records, subjugate themselves to any of the other two?
The short answer is that the various MST3K alumni are in different places, physically and professionally. They are where they are comfortable and successful. It really is not more complicated than that.
That said, an old MSTie friend of mine said to me the other day “We’re probably closer to a ‘five doctors‘ moment than we have been in a long time” and I think that’s right. These two new projects mean some sort of one-off reunion is probably more likely than it has been since the show ended. But that will have to come organically.
Speaking of competition, any particular reason why Cinematic Titanic (a project that hasn’t really started yet) is first in the links list and The Film Crew (which already has had a’many projects out) is next to bottom on the page, right next to “Darkstar” – which, many years on, still hasn’t been released yet.
Speaking of which, whatever happened to “Darkstar”!?
Before I added the new Cinematic Titanic and MST3K.COM links to the sidebar, Sampo and I discussed the best way to list them along with the already-existing RiffTrax link. We decided that putting them alphabetically would be the most fair. Unfortunately, we forgot to look further down the page and completely neglected the long-existing Film Crew link. You’re right, it should be listed alphabetically as well. Consider it fixed!
As for Darkstar…well, only time will tell. J. Allen Williams, the game’s producer, says on his site that it’s still in production, so keep an eye out there for further information.
The problem I see with reuniting (as wonderful as that would be) is WHO WOULD HOST? Would we have FOUR people in the theatre now? Oops, 2 people, 2 robots? ;)
I like that they’re all doing different things, although I have to say – not sure how I feel about the new voice for Servo…hmm….
Anyway the more MST3K stuff around, the better!
PS I *heart* Mike *swoon* LOL
“Sampo, the writer is obviously nostalgiac for the old “Joel vs. Mike” flame wars.”
The writer is here, and she’s ready to dispute that.
Hi everyone, I’m Mary Beth Ellis, the author of the article. First of all, thank you for clicking on the link and for your comments.
To be perfectly honest, I think some of you are missing my intentions in the article. I carefully chose quotes from Mike to show that he does NOT view this as a zero-sum game… and, frankly, neither do I, as I state in the very last sentence of the article. This is a great time to be a MSTie, and I look forward to what all former cast members have to offer.
Hello Mary Beth and thanks for dropping by.
Please note that I said it was a very nice piece and it really is. The interview transcript over on Rifftrax.com is hilarious.
I get the sense that the “in competition” line was added by the copy desk. It’s typical (I’ve worked with many a copy desk in my day, so I feel your pain). :-)
Mary Beth,
Thanks for stopping by.
I was joking.
Thanks, Sampo. You guessed correctly– note that the article I sent in and the article that was actually published are quite different! And, of course, the caption and headline are all MSNBC’s.
Oh, I could tell you copy desk stories…
Okay, one: Somewhere back in the early ’90s I interviewed Weird Al Yankovic for the Phila. Inquirer (where I freelanced steadily for more than a decade). By the way, very nice guy, very funny and personable on the phone. Anyway, when the piece came out I was HORRIFIED to discover that they had inserted, without telling me, a line that said he was the son of noted polka band leader Frankie Yankovic (the two are not related and I knew that). I was mortified.
I recently interviewed him again and had a chance to apologize for it. He didn’t remember, of course, but he said “If it makes you feel any better, when Frankie Yankovic died, ABC News called me for a comment. So you’re not the only one.”
Sampo, thanks for the feedback. I do think that my original post may have been taken a tiny bit too literally. I really had two points, which I’ll cover in reverse order from the original comments above.
The final idea I was originally expressing is what every MST3K fan has wished since the show’s demise, that being that there would be more MST3K. Is it realistic to think there will be? Not really, but with virtually all of the original cast and crew now free from long-term Hollywood contracts, etc., the thought that the potential for a reunion of some sort is now higher than ever has likely crossed the mind of most MSTies. No, The Beatles can’t get back together, but Beatles fans still like to think about how wonderful it would be if they could.
Second, I was gently pointing out that it is at least slightly absurd that all of the original members of the cast and crew may be refusing a full-scale reunion, but they are all now making MST3K-like material on their own in small groups anyway. That seems at least a bit ironic. Do I support these “MST3K-lite” efforts? Absolutely, I own all four Film Crew DVDs, several Legend Film’s DVDs with commentary by Mike Nelson, and I’ll likely buy what Joel Hodgson is about to offer through Cinematic Titanic as well. However, that doesn’t make it any less odd, ironic, absurd, whatever adjective you’d care to use, that everyone who left MST3K is now basically doing it again, and with many of the same people, in spite of refusing to get together for full-blown new MST3K. There are many different reasons for this I’m sure, some of which you’ve pointed out in your reply above, but it doesn’t make it seem any less ironic that they’re all basically making the same show again separately rather than together.
Finally, one more point. Let me say thanks to you and Erhardt for maintaining this site for all these years. It has been and continues to be a wonderful resource for keeping MST3K alive in one form or another. This site is an MST3K essential and I suspect that Rhino Video and all the former MST3K writers and performers owe much of their post-MST3K success to you guys for all the previews and other information about their projects you post here. Movie Sign!
Bob:
First of all, thanks for your kind words about the site. We live to serve ya. :-) Don’t feel I’m taking you to task, here. I see the point your making, I’m just expressing my own view.
On the first point–the issue of MSTies who want to see SOME sort of get-together: agreed. Of course all MSTies would love to see that, and as I said, some sort of one-off reunion is probably closer to happening now than it has been, well, since Joel visited Mike on the SOL. Fingers crossed!
On the second point–the question of why they don’t just all work together full time–I guess I just am questioning the premise of the question. You say they are “refusing” to join forces, as if it was a foregone conclusion that this is the obvious thing they SHOULD do. The question I keep asking is: “Why SHOULD they?” (Aside from the fact that fans WANT them to, I mean.)
To me it’s a little like saying: “GM makes cars, Ford makes cars, it’s a bit ironic, a bit absurd, that they aren’t doing it together.” I fail to see to see the irony or the absurdity. Several different entities, each with their own established abilities, are engaged in a similar enterprise. I suspect they feel no impetus whatsoever to join forces.
Yes, but the founders of GM and Ford didn’t start out together, split apart to do something different, then suddenly decide to get back into the same business they originally started out in together but separately! It’s really not an issue, I was merely pointing out that the situation seemed a bit humorous or maybe even a little absurd. That said, I’m glad they’re doing what they’re doing because the results have been entertaining and I’m really looking forward to Cinematic Titanic!